The ABCs of Subrogation: A Lawyer’s Guide (2025 Edition)

T. Blake Orner
Ashton T. Kirsch
Christopher R. Vandeventer
T. Blake Orner | Grant & Grant
Ashton T. Kirsch | Matthiesen, Wickert & Lehrer, S.C.
Christopher R. Vandeventer | Matthiesen, Wickert & Lehrer, S.C.

On-Demand: February 21, 2025

3 hour CLE

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Program Summary

Session I – Subrogation Fundamentals: Strategies to Avoid Pitfalls and Maximize Recovery – T. Blake Orner

This session will cover the fundamentals of subrogation claims. We will address the common mistakes and pitfalls that are made in subrogation cases and how to avoid them. We will explore the underlying law and legal strategies for the recovery of medical payment and workers compensation liens, including addressing the common fund and made whole doctrines. Finally, we will outline the best approach to handling large loss property subrogation claims, legal considerations, and real case examples.

Key topics to be discussed:

  • Subrogation Basics
  • Common Hurdles and Mistakes in Handling Subrogation Claims
  • Understanding Subrogation Liens: Medical Payments and Workers Compensation
  • Property Subrogation: Legal Issues and Strategies

Session II – Complex Subrogation: Litigation Strategies and Practical Guidance – Ashton Kirsch and Christopher Vandeventer

This session will delve into advanced strategies for handling subrogation claims. It will focus on sophisticated techniques and risk management strategies to enhance recovery and minimize losses in subrogation cases. The session will also address complex issues that arise in subrogation litigation and provide practical guidance for navigating them.

Key topics to be discussed:

  • Navigating Complex Subrogation Issues
  • Strategic Use of Expert Witnesses
  • Lien Prioritization and Allocation
  • Dealing with Subrogation in Bankruptcy and Insolvency Cases
  • Statutory and Regulatory Updates

This course is co-sponsored with myLawCLE.

Closed-captioning available

Speakers

T. Blake Orner_FedBarT. Blake Orner | Grant & Grant

Blake Orner is a partner with the law firm of Grant & Grant in Indianapolis, Indiana. Blake’s practice is focused on Litigation—both subrogation and personal injury. He represents many national and regional insurance carriers in complex subrogation litigation, including large structural fires for commercial and residential property, construction defects, and products liability. With a background in complex litigation, Blake also focuses on plaintiffs’ personal injury, including auto accidents, premise liability, commercial trucking collisions, and product liability.

Licensed to practice in both Indiana and Illinois, Blake has represented clients in both state and federal court. Further, as part of his practice, Blake coordinates the litigation of cases with law firms for matters arising in other states throughout the country, as well as being retained by out-of-state law firms to serve as local counsel in Indiana and Illinois.

Blake is a graduate of DePauw University and the Indiana University Robert H. McKinney School of Law. He is a member of the National Association of Subrogation Professionals (NASP), Indiana State Bar Association, Illinois State Bar Association and serves on the Executive Committee of the Litigation Section of the Indianapolis Bar Association.

 

Ashton T. Kirsch_FedBarAshton T. Kirsch | Matthiesen, Wickert & Lehrer, S.C.

Ashton T. Kirsch is an insurance litigation attorney and shareholder with the law firm of Matthiesen, Wickert & Lehrer, S.C. Ashton has been with MWL’s Hartford office since 2015, concentrating his practice on litigation of subrogation cases involving large loss casualty, commercial auto, transportation and cargo, and workers’ compensation. He has built and grown the MWL commercial auto and cargo/transportation group into the thriving sector of our firm’s subrogation practice.

Ashton is an expert in the handling of complex interstate transportation claims. He knows the ins, outs, and in-betweens of the labyrinth of federal regulations that can impact a commercial auto or cargo loss. In fact, he has been retained by other attorneys around the nation to serve as an expert and consult/train on both the MCS-90 Endorsement and Carmack Amendment. Through this unique knowledge base, Ashton has successfully litigated and recovered on countless claims where others could not. He also boasts another, unique expertise—high-level negotiation tactics and skills which maximize the likelihood of high dollar recoveries. He travels the country providing seminars and training sessions to attorneys and adjusters on the best negotiation tactics and litigation practices. With over 95% of claims settling prior to litigation and 99% of litigated cases settling prior to trial, negotiation skills are at the pinnacle of importance to a successful subrogation attorney. Ashton is currently writing a book on subrogation negotiations practices, which will be published within the next year.

Ashton obtained his Bachelor of Arts in Political Science and History from the University of Wisconsin–Madison. He went on to graduate from the University of Wisconsin Law School, focusing on finance and corporate litigation. In 2018, 2019, 2020, 2021, and 2022, he was named a Wisconsin Rising Star by SuperLawyers Magazine, an award given only to the top 2.5% of lawyers in the State. In December 2022, Claims Litigation Management (CLM) recognized Ashton as one of their Phenoms Under 40, an award for selected individuals under the age of 39 who are making a significant impact at their companies or firms, or on the claims industry as a whole. Prior to joining MWL, Ashton was a founding partner and legal counsel with Bankmybiz.com an online lending/banking platform. He was also general counsel for a real estate development consulting group. Ashton is an experienced politician, winning a three-way primary as a candidate for Wisconsin’s 81st Assembly District in 2014, and is a former member of Governor Scott Walker’s legal team. He also served as a judicial intern to Justice Paul Higginbotham in the Wisconsin Court of Appeals, IV District. Ashton is known throughout the field for his knowledge of legal and legislative issues. He has been invited to testify on numerous occasions before legislative bodies and administrative agencies on insurance-related issues. Specifically, he has been asked to testify before the legislative committee on tort reform legislation, collateral source rules, insurance mandatory minimum limits, insurance regulatory compliance, and other commercial auto-related issues. Ashton brings precisely the sort of “real world” experience that makes an excellent litigator for the insurance industry.

 

Speaker_Christopher R. Vandeventer_FedBarChristopher R. Vandeventer | Matthiesen, Wickert & Lehrer, S.C.

Christopher R. Vandeventer is an associate attorney in our Hartford, Wisconsin office. Chris’s practice focuses on automobile, property and casualty, and workers’ compensation subrogation. Chris received his J.D. from Marquette University Law School in Milwaukee, Wisconsin. Chris is licensed in Wisconsin, where he helps MWL with its growing book of nationwide subrogation litigation.

Agenda

Session I – Subrogation Fundamentals: Strategies to Avoid Pitfalls and Maximize Recovery | 1:00pm – 3:10pm

  • Subrogation Basics
  • Common Hurdles and Mistakes in Handling Subrogation Claims

Break | 2:00pm – 2:10pm

  • Understanding Subrogation Liens: Medical Payments and Workers Compensation
  • Property Subrogation: Legal Issues and Strategies

Break | 3:10pm – 3:20pm

Session II – Complex Subrogation: Litigation Strategies and Practical Guidance | 3:20pm – 4:20pm

  • Navigating Complex Subrogation Issues
  • Strategic Use of Expert Witnesses
  • Lien Prioritization and Allocation
  • Dealing with Subrogation in Bankruptcy and Insolvency Cases
  • Statutory and Regulatory Updates

Credits

Alaska

Approved for CLE Credits
3 General

Our programs are CLE-eligible through Alaska’s recognition of multi-jurisdictional reciprocity.
Alabama

Approved for Self-Study Credits
3 General

Arkansas

Approved for CLE Credits
3 General

Arizona

Approved for CLE Credits
3 General

California

Approved for CLE Credits
3 General

Colorado

Pending CLE Approval
3 General

Connecticut

Approved for CLE Credits
3 General

District of Columbia

No MCLE Required
3 CLE Hours

Delaware

Pending CLE Approval
3 General

Florida

Approved via Attorney Submission
3.5 General

Receive CLE credit in Florida via attorney submission.
Georgia

Approved for CLE Credits
3 General

Hawaii

Approved for CLE Credits
3.6 General

Iowa

Pending CLE Approval
3 General

Idaho

Pending CLE Approval
3 General

Illinois

Approved for Self-Study Credits
3 General

Indiana

Approved for Self-Study Credits
3 General

Kansas

Pending CLE Approval
3 Substantive

Kentucky

Pending CLE Approval
3 General

Louisiana

Pending CLE Approval
3 General

Massachusetts

No MCLE Required
3 CLE Hours

Maryland

No MCLE Required
3 CLE Hours

Maine

Pending CLE Approval
3 General

Michigan

No MCLE Required
3 CLE Hours

Minnesota

Approved for Self-Study Credits
3 General

Missouri

Approved for CLE Credits
3.6 General

Mississippi

Pending CLE Approval
3 General

Montana

Pending CLE Approval
3 General

North Carolina

Pending CLE Approval
3 General

North Dakota

Approved for CLE Credits
3 General

Our programs are CLE-eligible through North Dakota’s recognition of multi-jurisdictional reciprocity. Section 1, Policy 1.14
Nebraska

Pending CLE Approval
3 General

myLawCLE reports attendance to Nebraska on each attorney’s behalf for all programs. Please do not self-report.
New Hampshire

Approved for CLE Credits
180 General Minutes

As of July 1, 2014, the NHMCLE Board no longer provides pre- or post-approval of courses. Attendees must self-determine whether a program is eligible for credit, and self-report their attendance online at www.nhbar.org, based on qualification provisions of Rule 53.
New Jersey

Approved for CLE Credits
3.6 General

Our programs are CLE-eligible through New Jersey’s recognition of multi-jurisdictional reciprocity, except for the courses required under BCLE Reg. 201:2
New Mexico

Approved for Self-Study Credits
3 General

Nevada

Approved for Self-Study Credits
3 General

New York

Approved for CLE Credits
3.6 General

Our programs are CLE-eligible through New York’s Approved Jurisdiction Group “B”.
Ohio

Approved for Self-Study Credits
3 General

Oklahoma

Pending CLE Approval
3.5 General

Oregon

Pending CLE Approval
3 General

Pennsylvania

Approved for Self-Study Credits
3 General

Rhode Island

Pending CLE Approval
3.5 General

South Carolina

Pending CLE Approval
3 General

South Dakota

No MCLE Required
3 CLE Hours

Tennessee

Approved for Self-Study Credits
3 General

Texas

Approved for CLE Credits
3 General

Utah

Pending CLE Approval
3 General

Virginia

Not Eligible
3 General Hours

Vermont

Approved for CLE Credits
3 General

Washington

Approved via Attorney Submission
3 Law & Legal

Receive CLE credit in Washington via attorney submission.
Wisconsin

Approved for Self-Study Credits
3 General

West Virginia

Pending CLE Approval
3.6 General

Wyoming

Pending CLE Approval
3 General

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